Newb Looking for advice on affordable micro/mini RTF

[Mike H.]

That reminds me, how important do you guys think a brushed motor is VS. brushed? Just checked out a video review of the Bayang 9, nice but only 5.5 mins flight time no way you could mount a cam on it at least I don't think there is, the guy said its a clone of another model, can't remember which?

The X9 is super lightweight clone of the Blade nQX...It uses small 6mm motors as does the blade and is actually not far off from the performance of that $100.00 blade...This is one i have coming as it gets very good reviews and is said to be a very good indoor flyer...the bayang is considered the best clone of the Blade model...Parts are extremely cheap to make repairs on this model.

I think you mean brushed vs brushless?

Two complete different worlds in cost and reliability...Brushless is what the hobby grade industry uses and these can get very expensive..Brushless motors are used on DJI's and other high dollar quads...they require seperate electronic speed controllers for each motor and usually use a 2s lipo or stronger to power them...Certainly not something you want to run into someone with by accident.

To add more about the bayang x9..It uses a small 150mah battery...the entire quad including battery is less than 20g in weight...some are using 200mah batteries to improve flight time to just over 6 minutes.

The syma X5C without the prop gaurds and camera and landing gear usually gets around 6 to 7 minutes (Almost 8 minutes with a 750 mah battery) with the stock 500 mah battery and just under 4 minutes using the camera and with the gaurds and landing gear attached...the camera uses the onboard battery for power as well so this takes away from flight time.

With a keychain camera such as the 808, it has its own battery so, flight times usually increase by 1 minute or so...Some remove the camera from the case to lose some weight.

The average flight times for most all these toy quads are typically 5 to 7 minutes.

 

[HDtallrider]

The brushed motors you see in the quads you are looking at are DC. They need gear reduction to produce the power they need to give the quad good performance. The brushless motors we use in "real" quads are 3 phase AC. They produce tremendous power for their size and don't need gear reduction to fly. For example; a 3508 kv380 T-Motor is 35mm in diameter with an 8mm tall magnet bell. with a 6s battery it can produce nearly 1 1/2 HP!! That's why we use them in "real" quads. (snicker.....)

 

[Mike H.]

Brushed motors typically wear out much faster but, with proper care some can last as much as 40 to 50 battery packs of flight.

The 7.4 brushed models are as powerful as you can get for toy quads...that x8c being able to lift 200g is no joke for a toy, to be honest..Thats impressive for the price range.

Unless your serious about quads and can fly pretty good, the high end models arent a good place to start...It would be more headache than it would be fun with all you need to know about programming and not to mention cost..When you crash a "real" quad its expensive.

 

[Mike H.]

I think tallrider is going to convert to toy quads and forget about his hobby models...lmao.

Especially when he installs that jjrc board in his x5c-1

 

[HDtallrider]

I think tallrider is going to convert to toy quads and forget about his hobby models...lmao.

Especially when he installs that jjrc board in his x5c-1

Hahaha!! I admit that these are fun little buggers. Because weight , for example, is so critical I find myself re-thinking and re-designing my "real" quads. When you graduate, Skybird, you will have a solid base learned while playing with "toys".

 

[Skybird]

Brushed motors typically wear out much faster but, with proper care some can last as much as 40 to 50 battery packs of flight.

The 7.4 brushed models are as powerful as you can get for toy quads...that x8c being able to lift 200g is no joke for a toy, to be honest..Thats impressive for the price range.

Unless your serious about quads and can fly pretty good, the high end models arent a good place to start...It would be more headache than it would be fun with all you need to know about programming and not to mention cost..When you crash a "real" quad its expensive.

So brushless motors are favored because they last longer and stand up to the elements the like motor in Wind Turbines, which before going into this craze I was researching to put a wind turbine on the property, another story. Anyhow I just watched a comparison video between the X5-C and X8 and it's a monster in comparison, the blades alone are twice the size, that definitely is more along the lines of a Phantom, still I don't know where I would be able to fly something like that around here without someone freaking out and calling the local law.

Hahaha!! I admit that these are fun little buggers. Because weight , for example, is so critical I find myself re-thinking and re-designing my "real" quads. When you graduate, Skybird, you will have a solid base learned while playing with "toys".

I don't doubt it, funny thing is I thought the FAA was going to make a clear distinction with the new law between commercial drones and toys and that's not looking like the case and I'm getting really concerned about that, we are going to have pay registration fees to register these toy quads and they aren't going be any different then the commercial fees. I sure hope I'm wrong about that. I mean the Syma birds can get pretty high up even though they are toys, and with mods my guess higher?

To add more about the bayang x9..It uses a small 150mah battery...the entire quad including battery is less than 20g in weight...some are using 200mah batteries to improve flight time to just over 6 minutes.

The syma X5C without the prop gaurds and camera and landing gear usually gets around 6 to 7 minutes (Almost 8 minutes with a 750 mah battery) with the stock 500 mah battery and just under 4 minutes using the camera and with the gaurds and landing gear attached...the camera uses the onboard battery for power as well so this takes away from flight time.

With a keychain camera such as the 808, it has its own battery so, flight times usually increase by 1 minute or so...Some remove the camera from the case to lose some weight.

I like it, but I'm not sure it's what I'm looking for for starters and I really don't want to have to wait for that slow boat from China, lol all I could find on ecrap was the x7 and it has a fixed battery, so that makes it disposable lol.

 

[HDtallrider]

I find Amazon Prime to be competitive enough that I use them a fair amount. It's an American company and I get stuff fast. I always want everything NOW.
I bought a special X5c1 package from them. It came in a slick aluminum case that is going to be perfect for my new ground station.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B013OQHZ18?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00

It came with extra stuff and that perfect case. All in all I thought it was a fine deal.

 

[Skybird]

So I guess since you haven't had much to say I'm guessing you guys aren't much fans of FPV Wifi, no doubt because it's 2.4 ghz and it interferes with the controller. The reason I'm asking is because I like the fact that the Cheerson Cx-30w, doesn't store images on a sd card but sends them directly to the phone, or is that not a good feature? Then again that is the one that seems to lose signal a lot, at least that's what I saw in some videos. any idea how this one stacks up against the X11C? I also like the Syma X5SW with the wifi, but not the color lol. By the way I'm not totally green to controlling, I have done some RC flight sims on the computer but only with a joystick, but I also have a nice PS2 flight game sky oddysey, so I'm not a total greenhorn, more of an armchair Pilot, was first bitten by MS Flight Sim 3.0 back in the 80's and just kept going lol.

 

[Mike H.]

The wifi models arent getting very good reviews at all...basically they dont work worth a crap...There are wifi models where you talk to the quad and tell it what to do as well...The wifi feature is just in too early of stages and needs alot of refining on the quads.

The X5C-1 is the clear winner here for for the X5 model line up.

The range on the syma is maybe 30 to 40 meters but there is a very inexpensive "range mod" that people perform to give it well over 100 meters of range and solve that issue.

Banggood also can ship from the USA ..the selection of replacement parts and models are limited however...i got my hubsan X4 in about 6 days from them...they ship out of california.

The prices can be a bit higher however from the US warehouse compared to china...it is still free shipping but the added costs im sure helps them pay for it.

Heres a link to the usa warehouse...they may have something you like. http://us.banggood.com/wh_buy/Usa/Quadcopter/0-0-0-1-1-45-0-price-0-0_p-1.html?sortType=desc
My choices from there would be any of these 3 which all are popular and ship from the US...All have cameras
Syma X5C-1
JJRC H5C CF
JJRC H6C (Hubsan X4 sized)

The JJRC H5C CF is a new "improved" version of the H5C and has quite a few improvements over the Syma X5C-1...They use larger 8.5mm motors instead of 7mm making it considerably more powerful and ,the range should be double that of the x5c-1 if not even more with no mods needed to the radio.. its also less money by a few dollars and has a better tuned flight board in general (more aggressive in high rates)...This is the only model i would consider above the syma as an RTF pakage but, would still take a syma in a heart beat.

Heres a run down on the syma X5 models.

Syma's first was the X5..no camera...Then they came out with the X5C which received a camera but the stability was an issue as they never revised the flight board to compensate for the added weight..Then comes the X5C-1 of which syma revised the board making it more stable and is the go to Syma model today.

JJRC had the H5C which competed with the X5C and did have a better board to handle the camera from the start...Now the H5C CF adds more powerful motors and just has whats to be considered better flight characteristics and much better range, as well as an improved transmitter if im not mistaken...JJRC has always had great range and always tries to one up syma and, they succeed at that quite often.

Hope some of this helps.

 

[GJH105775]

"Rock a bye Syma on the tree top, when the wind blows my Syma will drop"..haha.

Hahahahaha, that was by far one of the funniest things I have read all month haha.

 

[HDtallrider]

Hahahahaha, that was by far one of the funniest things I have read all month haha.

How come you always think it's funny when I'm on the receiving end? Huh? Huh?

 

[Skybird]

The wifi models arent getting very good reviews at all...basically they dont work worth a crap...There are wifi models where you talk to the quad and tell it what to do as well...The wifi feature is just in too early of stages and needs alot of refining on the quads.

I watched last night a review by quad101 about the X5SW and how the wifi, interferes with the transmitter and cuts down the signal, he said all you need to is insulate the wifi transmitter with foil,

and it improves, I guess if I get that one I can find, out, like the CX-30W it does not have a sd card and only sends photos to the video and phone, not sure I like that feature after all, lol

The X5C-1 is the clear winner here for for the X5 model line up.

The range on the syma is maybe 30 to 40 meters but there is a very inexpensive "range mod" that people perform to give it well over 100 meters of range and solve that issue.

Banggood also can ship from the USA ..the selection of replacement parts and models are limited however...i got my hubsan X4 in about 6 days from them...they ship out of california.

The prices can be a bit higher however from the US warehouse compared to china...it is still free shipping but the added costs im sure helps them pay for it.

Heres a link to the usa warehouse...they may have something you like. http://us.banggood.com/wh_buy/Usa/Quadcopter/0-0-0-1-1-45-0-price-0-0_p-1.html?sortType=desc
My choices from there would be any of these 3 which all are popular and ship from the US...All have cameras
Syma X5C-1
JJRC H5C CF
JJRC H6C (Hubsan X4 sized)

The JJRC H5C CF is a new "improved" version of the H5C and has quite a few improvements over the Syma X5C-1...They use larger 8.5mm motors instead of 7mm making it considerably more powerful and ,the range should be double that of the x5c-1 if not even more with no mods needed to the radio.. its also less money by a few dollars and has a better tuned flight board in general (more aggressive in high rates)...This is the only model i would consider above the syma as an RTF pakage but, would still take a syma in a heart beat.

I also saw a video of a guy flying his X5-C1 in the rain and it flies fairly well indoors.
The X5C is also a good quad for tricks when you take everything off , so you have two quads in one.

The JJRC H5C looks identical to the X5-C1, is the cam mount the same, if so then you should be able to mount the FPV cam?

Heres a run down on the syma X5 models.

Syma's first was the X5..no camera...Then they came out with the X5C which received a camera but the stability was an issue as they never revised the flight board to compensate for the added weight..Then comes the X5C-1 of which syma revised the board making it more stable and is the go to Syma model today.

Well that answered my next question, what the difference between X5C and X5C-1, thanks, check out this video, this guy shows that the X5C-1 can fly in the rain and indoors!
I am leaning that way unless the JJRC impresses me more. I also like the U818S for it's really cool flight yoke controller. I also like the JJRC H11D Eye Of God, it has a remote cam that goes up and down, but I don't like the color, do people ever paint their quads? Camo, probably not the best idea since how would you spot in in a treeline?
Also I was wondering if anyone has ever found a controller at a Goodwill? Ive seen controllers before but just didn't know what they were for?


JJRC had the H5C which competed with the X5C and did have a better board to handle the camera from the start...Now the H5C CF adds more powerful motors and just has whats to be considered better flight characteristics and much better range, as well as an improved transmitter if im not mistaken...JJRC has always had great range and always tries to one up syma and, they succeed at that quite often.

Hope some of this helps.

I will check them out.
One thing I was wondering about the X5C FPV addon, does that cam have a SD card slot? Otherwise how do you take video or photos? It says in the description you can, but I don't see how? Here's quads review on it, very nice

The cam can also be mounted on a X5SW, You should see my Youtube history, Syma this, Quad that lol. I checked out some of the nano video and I couldn't believe how fast those little guys are and how they perform outside, maybe will get one of those since they don't cost much. I joined an RC forum here in OR. hopefully they will be able to tell me how the law works and give me some more pointers on where to fly, I was outside today on the 3/4 acres property I live on and I think there is plenty of room to practice on. Just concerned about the neighbors, but since it rains a lot here will most likely be flying a lot indoors. lol

 

[Mike H.]

The SD cards click in and out from a port on the case...The transmitter will have a picture and video button to turn it on and off.

Hers a tip..if you record make sure to turn the camera off before unplugging the quad or you will lose your video.

Heres another tip as well many dont know about...it would be kind of expensive unless you can find an 808 camera that doesnt work..but the wide angle lens can be fitted to the stock syma camera for much better video coverage...There is a write up on that some where on how its done.

I would still get the no camera version and pay for the 808 camera...the difference in quality is quite a bit and with a dedicated battery for the 808 flight times wont suffer into the 4 minute range...youll get 6 plus minutes with the 808 on a stock 500mah battery...7 and up with a 750 mah....Make sure its the 808 #16 V3 camera if you get one though...they run about $45-$50...Heck, it might can even be fitted into the stock syma case..not sure really.

When i get my FY326 and install my jjrc 1000 board in it, i also plan to install a nano FPV system inside the body with a hole cut out in the center front of the quad for the lens and adjust the angle from inside.

No doubt those little quads are speed demons..Two of the most popular right now are the JJRC 1000A and the Eachine H8 mini.

I LOVE my JJRC 1000A...its my favorite so far.

The only thing is the radio sucks it comes with..mit has an auto flip on the throttle that not many care for..I just bought the bnf model and bought a $12.00 Tarantula X6 radio to fly it with..What a treat that combo is...You can get the JJRC 1000A bnf for $12.49 from china...Around $16.00 state side.

 

[HDtallrider]

Skybird, I will give you the opinion of a COB(crusty old biker) as my oldest granddaughter gets a kick out of calling me. Get two quads. Pick one of the baby quads Mike H. gives his blessing to and fly that one indoors. Get the Syma X5c1 to learn to fly outdoors. I have only had mine a couple weeks now and I think it is one of the best trainers out there. It doesn't have all the stuff that flies it for you. You HAVE to fly it all the time which makes it perfect to learn on. It flies very much like a smaller version of one of my "real" quads. I am rethinking my plans to hot rod this baby. Mike may have overlooked an important feature of the X5c1. Because it moves like it weighs more than it does it feels larger than it is. The control inputs are solid instead of "twitchy", just like a "real" quad. It builds speed gradually, Turns are larger and smoother. Not like some of the rockets Mike likes so much. I'm going to keep the Syma pretty much the way it is and use the JJRC Mike talked me into for the occasional adrenaline rush. Anyway, that's my opinion and I'm stickin' to it!

 

[Skybird]

Wow Mike your fast, I'm still editing my reply lol, I'm going to add one more video of the guy flying in the rain, also. I get that the thing about the SD Card and unplugging,it must be a power thing. I was going to ask you about the wide angle lense. I saw a video where they installed a spektrum micro on a plane and glued a wide angle lens on it, I'm sure that would improve FPV for better viewing.

So your saying the 808 camera has an SD card slot? I sure can understand about it having it's own battery, the video talked about that. Makes sense not to get the no cam version, since you are not going to use it anyway, unless for backup.

Any chance of mounting a spectrum Micro to something like an X9 or just too small? There are a few Syma X5 clones out there, one has a 4 gig SD card that comes with it I don't remember the name and the other I just found out is the FY326 that is supposed to beat the real thin, funny I didn't see you had said that before I typed this. So you can't really share thoughts on the FY326 yet, lol. One last thing is this the antenna upgrade you were referring to and does it work on the clones?

 

[Mike H.]

That jjrc is bad a$$.

Calm cool and collected on 40% rate..Enough pitch to fight wind.

A sporty little devil on 60% rate...Keeps you on your toes.

A Menacing super bee on steroids in 100 % mode..Insane pitch for incredible speed.

Enjoy

 

[Mike H.]

Yes...the 808 also uses an SD card.

I dont know that much about the new spektrum set up but its not un common to add a wide angle lens to fpv or camera set ups.

The FY326 is a good flyer but cost is what is drawing me to it..$16.00 for an RTF...The FY326 much like the JJRC H5C CF uses much larger 8.5mm motors...More capable of handling a little more weigh of a real FPV set up and wind...The JJRC1000A board is programmed to be very agressive and can support the amperage a larger 8.5mm motor with much larger props can put out...This is one of the HYBRIDS ill be doing..It should be considered quite fast and agile for its size.

They have a FPV camera and RX that weighs a poulty 1 gram if you wanted it but, good luck getting one...they sell out faster than they can sell them...So yes..you can install fpv on an X9 if you wanted to.

 

[Mike H.]

This is for everyone. http://fpvhobby.com/

 

[Mike H.]

I may have to retract my statement of putting an fpv on the X9..i wasnt considering the weight of the battery needed to power it..Since the x9 only uses a 150mah battery to begin with its not enough to power the fpv system also which needs a 250 to 340 mah battery which can weigh another 8 to 10 grams..So that may be a bit much for those little 6mm motors and tiny props to handle.

On an x5c-1 it would be no issue at all...the stock camera would still weigh alot more if im not mistaken.

 

[Skybird]

I may have to retract my statement of putting an fpv on the X9..i wasnt considering the weight of the battery needed to power it..Since the x9 only uses a 150mah battery to begin with its not enough to power the fpv system also which needs a 250 to 340 mah battery which can weigh another 8 to 10 grams..So that may be a bit much for those little 6mm motors and tiny props to handle.

On an x5c-1 it would be no issue at all...the stock camera would still weigh alot more if im not mistaken.

Have to also consider the quality of the video isn't a Spektrum like 0.3 mp?
Your saying the 808 cam weighs less than the stock cam that comes with x5c-1
I found out the name of that other one that looks like the x5c it's Zuzo and the comment this guy made was that it was better than the Syma and it ships with a 4 gig card and has headless mode http://www.amazon.com/Drone-Camera-...8&qid=1445745767&sr=1-276&keywords=Quadcopter what do you think? Did you see my reply with the video for antenna upgrade? I just learned that the X5sw is only 0.3 mp but I just saw somewhere on Amazon that one or another is brushless for less than 100 bucks I don't think so.