First Quadcopter build started - video diary

H

Hugh Hemington

Well-Known Member
Wow! How odd! That looks like the same one I recently acquired, with hacked "SimpleBGC" firmware, and not a shred of documentation. Here's where I got mine: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00GAY5YBU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
It was recommended by Danny Choate at QuadLugs to go along with a 3D printed "lug" he has that hangs off the front of my quad. I went through less of the investigation you did before I just asked him and he said he has used the gimbal out of the box and had good results. I'll certainly look into what you did though, because I'd like to get the most out of it that I can.
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Hi Hugh,

The internet (ebay) is awash with the gimbal we both have or very similar variants. I think if the gimbal works well out
of the box then leave it alone and don't attempt to upgrade the firmware. I have played with both cracked and third
party firmware and they perform in a very similar way so it's probably not worth the pain of messing around.

However, my gimbal was close to flatline out of the box. I suspect the supplier had simply flashed the cracked firmware
and shipped. So although it was technically working non of the control loop PID parameters, motor powers or sensor
attitude data had been set up.

So I connected the control board to the SimpleBGC PC utility and set everything up optimising for the weight of my
Boscam HD08 camera. If you do decide to have a tweak the first step is to load the existing parameter data from
the gimbal and save to file so you have a point of reference to return to.

I'll be interested to hear how you get on :)

I am planing on getting everything mounted on the quad today - with all the extra weight I'll be lucky if it will fly at all :)

Once everything (gimbal + camera) is fitted planning on a test flight loitering in still air to measure the reduction in
flight time. Then I have a set of new Turnigy 2217 motors and 1047 props which I want to compare with the Emax
2216 and 1045 props I currently have fitted - will report on the difference (if any) once tested. I was getting flight times
of 12 minutes before the gimbal/camera fit plus a further 2 minutes before really running into trouble.

Cheers,

Dave
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Hello one & all,

I have been busy today - after all the normal family stuff I was granted a few hours play time so decided to get stuck
into fitting the gimbal on the quad and re-building where necessary in order to achieve balance. I now have a complete
model with two cameras, the Boscam TR1 with integrated 200mW Tx for FPV (also records HD) and the Boscam HD08
mounted on the two axis gimbal for recording flight video proper. This has resulted in quite a bit of extra weight and the
model complete now comes in at 1740g (bit of a fat boy). This has resulted in my flight time dropping from ~12min to
~9min before the battery alarm goes off. This flight time is achieved using a Turnigy 3300mAh 3S battery with
everything running from it including the FPV transmitter & gimbal.

The current consumed by the gimbal is about 300mA which is insignificant compared to the overall current consumption
and in theory only changes flight time by about 25 seconds - it's the weight which is the killer :(

Right here is a little once over of the beast as it currently stands .....

Cheers,

Dave


Overview of progress today :

 
H

Hugh Hemington

Well-Known Member
I've found a driver to see the SimpleBGC controller, but haven't found a version of the PC utility that will read or program it without balking about old firmware, so my board is obviously loaded with something really old.
How much do those torsional couplers weigh? I guess not much and there are only two of them. It looks like you aren't going to get a taller/wider battery in that space. HobbyKing has new MultiStar lipos that have a lower discharge rate and lower weight for the same volume so maybe one of those would help restore some of your flight time?
Did you plug your motor/ESC/prop values into eCalc? After my early experience, I'm always wary of overheating the motors.
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Hello Hugh,

Yes, the SimpleBGC PC utility is closely coupled to the firmware version running on the gimbal control board. So if you try and use
a later version of the PC software relative to the firmware on the control board it (the PC software) will not be happy.

The version I have on my gimbal is 2.3b4 and the PC software can be downloaded here :
http://www.basecamelectronics.com/downloads/8bit/

The couplers are not very heavy - I will pop one on the scales tomorrow and report back but we are talking about tens of grams.

I think I can fit a bigger battery in there - there is nothing that can't be fixed with a Dremel and a bit of head scratching :) Height is
not a problem, width is more of an issue but I think I have a plan to get a wider battery in.

I didn't use eCalc - tended to initially look at what other people were having success with and used a few rules of thumb.

As a matter of interest, how much does your beast weigh in at, what power system are you using and what kinda flight times
do you get as a result ?

Cheers,

Dave
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Evening everyone,

I have put together a charging solution for the LiPo batteries I currently have. I investigated the option of a single large charger
and then adopt a parallel charging technique or secondly to use multiple smaller chargers. After considering cost and flexibility
I decided on the latter option and am now using three separate IMAX B6 chargers.

Obviously a small video :)

Cheers,

Dave


 
H

Hugh Hemington

Well-Known Member
My Alien 560 has an all up weight of 1,852g with a 5000mah 4S lipo. It has 11" props on SunnySky motors and Afro 30a ESC. I've flown it over ten minutes but haven't tried to see how long it will fly. I'm still getting used to flying it, and by that time I'm ready for a break anyway.
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the information Hugh !

Sounds like weight wise we are very similar - my Alien is currently 1740g but with a smaller 3300mAh 3s battery. I currently have Turnigy 2217 motors and 1047 props fitted.

I am going to make a step change and order up a 5000mAh 4s battery and also a 12V UBEC to cover the 12V gimbal & FPV camera. My current chargers are capable of charging the new battery.

It will be interesting to see the incremental improvement in flight time - will report back.

Cheers,

Dave
 
H

Hugh Hemington

Well-Known Member
The Turnigy 2217 is a 3S motor, in both the 860kv and 1050kv variants (different windings). I'd find somebody who has run them successfully at 4S or try to. http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...er_USA_Warehouse_.html?strSearch=Turnigy 2217

Turnigy offers no specs, but I found this: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1816541
Which pretty much validates what I already knew and learned the hard way, trying to run 1100kv Turnigy motors on a 4S with 11" props. Motors/torque/props are a bit counter-intuitive. Since the key is torque, and that comes from current, you have to force current over voltage. If you run a 4S on those motors, you'll be limited to an 8 or 9" prop or overheated motors. That means you'll run the props a lot faster to get the same thrust and your flight time will be reduced, or stay the same, but won't likely increase.

I did the motor/lipo/prop error on my QuadLugs, which I switched DOWN to 3S. My Alien runs Sunnysky X3108S 720KV motors: http://www.banggood.com/Sunnysky-X3...-Brushless-Motor-For-Multirotor-p-907943.html
No, they're not $20 each! But they come with extra long leads, so the wires go all the way up the tubes, and these things are awesome. I'm running 30a Afro ESCs and I use the Quanum power distribution board which has integrated BECs for 5 & 12 volts.

If you get those SunnySky motors, do not use the long mounting screws to secure them -- get shorter ones. If you use the long screws on the carbon fiber plates, they go so far up into the body they could break the windings. I didn't do it but I almost did!
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Hi Hugh,

Yes, you are absolutely correct those Turnigy 2217 are 3S motors well there appears to be no specification for 4S.

Sorry my post wasn't very clear I was planning on using my original set of motors EMAX MT2216 which are rated 3s - 4s

http://www.emaxmodel.com/views.asp?hw_id=1292

I will give them a try at 4s and see how I get on. The Sunnysky motors do look the business, I am a bit concerned about
my Q-Brain ESC which is rated at 25A - the Sunnysky motors would be pushing it quite hard don't you think ? I don't
really want to have to replace my ESC's in addition to the motors ..... again :)

Cheers,

Dave
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Well they are ok motors but not in the same ball park as the Sunnysky offerings.

I had a look in more detail at the Sunnysky ratings and 'I think' I would be ok using my existing 25A ESCs. The
Sunnysky motors do pull current than would not be healthy for my ESCs but that only seems to be the case when they
are really heavily loaded with big 12" props. It looks like at more general loadings the current might be around
16A so I should be ok.

They do look very nice :)

Cheers,

Dave
 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
We finally got some ok weather ....

I shot a little video this afternoon :) comparing the output from the two cameras mounted on the Quad. The main
video was taken using the Boscam HD08 on the two axis stabilized gimbal featured on an earlier post. The inset
video was taken at the same time using the Boscam TR1 camera mounted simply on a foam pad directly above
the gimbal mount.

It is not the most inspiring piece of video as it just shows the Quad navigating the garden but it does show the
stabilizing effect of the budget Chinese import gimbal.

The Quad was flying in APM stabilized altitude hold flight mode.

Cheers,

Dave

 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Good afternoon everyone,

I have been making a few modification to the Quad ahead of an upgrade to 5000mHa 4s battery and possibly
an upgraded motor set. I was a bit concerned the Q-Brain 4 x 25A ESC I am using might be pushed a little
hard by larger motors. The FETs inside can handle the power assuming they can be kepted cool. The stock
heat management was just some heat conducting pads onto the aluminium top plate.

So I have fitted a small fan which sucks air through a series of holes drawing air through the sides of the
module and over the FET switching array - essentially forced air cooling.

Fingers crossed :)

Cheers,

Dave


 
dtrewren

dtrewren

Well-Known Member
Hello Hugh,

That little fan draws ~140mA at full pelt so not very much. However, my thinking was if the fan can lower the
MOSFET junction temperature by even a few degrees this lowers the Rds(on) of the transistor and makes it
more efficient. I have not worked the numbers but my gut feeling is the slight improvement efficiency will more
than pay for the consumption of the little fan.

And the fan is blowing down ........ hehe, I have a little centre thruster :)

Dave
 
H

Hugh Hemington

Well-Known Member
I'm used to seeing those fans in "blade" servers that run like demons. 140ma is not significant and is at least offset by cooler components.
 
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