450 frame build - advice

H

HDtallrider

Well-Known Member
Yeah. Shipping can be the most frustrating part of this hobby. I feel very fortunate living here because I can get everything I need in just a few days now that I don't order from China anymore. As far as info on various motors and esc's try googling " multirotor motor comparison" and " moultirotor ESC comparison," or however you want to word it, you will find a bunch of videos. Don't hesitate to jump on the forum with any question you may have. This forum is the friendliest and most helpful out there.
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
HDtallrider said:
Yeah. Shipping can be the most frustrating part of this hobby. I feel very fortunate living here because I can get everything I need in just a few days now that I don't order from China anymore. As far as info on various motors and esc's try googling " multirotor motor comparison" and " moultirotor ESC comparison," or however you want to word it, you will find a bunch of videos. Don't hesitate to jump on the forum with any question you may have. This forum is the friendliest and most helpful out there.
Click to expand...

Last first - this forum - I really do agree that this is one of the best - if not the best on any subject/theme - I have ever been a member of. Mods are not acting like egotisitcal stormtroopers keeping you in order!! and no forum hobgoblins stomping on your flowers...so to speak!

Checking out Amazon....not found one that will ship to Oz - even though most are in HK/China. eBay first two I checked out - Neg FB said FAKE motors. Wife came in to ask why what hair I had is now scattered all over the room!
I am giving the thread a breather and taking a day off - garden needs work and having spent the budget for a new rain water tank pump and water switch on the Phantom... the boss is giving me serious grief!

Thanks yet again for help, time and advice.
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
Stupid Question time! I have become familiar with motors being sold in pairs cc and ccw - I see SunnySky 2212 980kv sold only as single items - so buying four.. am I right in thinking wires are switched around to change polarity?
But.. no change in the prop threads?
 
ringolong

ringolong

Well-Known Member
You are correct, and it does not matter which wire is switched to get the correct rotation since it they are phase 3.
 
H

HDtallrider

Well-Known Member
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
HDtallrider said:
Ringalong is right and to make sure the prop nut can't loosen you can use a tiny drop of blue Threadlocker.
Instead of using this style prop;
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...8482_Propeller_11x4_7_White_CW_CCW_4pcs_.html

Use one that mounts like this; (I just picked random examples, not specific sizes)
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...tyle_Propeller_15x5_5_Black_CW_CCW_2pcs_.html

Any good quality motor has this mounting (preferred) as well as an adapter for airplane style props.
Click to expand...

Thanks guys.
The SunnySky I found on the Foxtech website - logic is they are genuine - also found Foxtechs "own" brand.

HD - Thanks for the HK stuff.... Confess I am looking/using their site more - on the premise that you actually get what you pay for.

Current situation seems to be - sourced Motors, ESCs in transit, uBEC in transit (2 - 1 from aussie and 1 from China! Aussie was ordered in case the other is a clone)
Flight control - CC3D in transit - although looking at:-
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/..._Flight_Controller_w_FTDI_DSM2_Comp_Port.html

EverBuying are insistent they sent the Devo 10 - supplied a "tracker" which shows it arrived in Sydney customs on 17/10/15 - snag is I got the email on the 16th !
Looked at the tracking site - and - to me its a fake set up.( paranoia setting in??) Supposed to be big in storage etc,. Google maps show the have at best a 600sq foot unit. Funny how EB seem to have a tracker just using their order number! Next week should tell.
If it does arrive - just need batteries and charger.

Thanks again...
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
I am beginning to feel humble!!!!!

Anybody reading my posts know I have had sooooo many issues with Everbuying. I currently have an delivery on 36 days and counting! BUT the refund issued for the Syma fiasco with a bit added let me order a Devo 10.
No photo of the outgoing package - no tracking number which I am sure I included ( I did for a $10 order so why not for a $150 order???) In view of the long drawn out "Ticket" to resove the matter - I accpted a $30 credit... but suggested it was pathetic - and from there their offers increased and took their lead! Then stuff I ordered for the Syma got late - still not arrived - so I decided that as this was part of the original credit for my first order - which was out of stock and credited to pay for the Syma ( still with me?) I decided that EB were simply not sending anything related to the Syma "refund".
As they advised no tracking included in order... surprisingly - the number normally associated with China Post unregistered - was suddenly tracked and the sent a link. It shows the item arrived at China Post on 15/10/15 - arrived today - 5 days !!!!
I have followed this tracking and was amazed to see it land at Sydney customs - even more amazed this morning to see it was collected and at our local post office and out for delivery today. EVEN more amazed that i have just unboxed it!
All was well no external damage - no internal damage unpacked it and it looked "new" the name plate and LCD display still had the vinyl covers - but the box had no sticky seals normally seen on ex factory stuff and ...mmm oh dear.... the included DVD.. had been opened and it does have finger marks on it!

So I have a question guys....it now has batteries... and it turns on - I move the left stick and it opens a screen for mod 1.
Is there any way I can check its 100% functioning - without having a Flight Control board?

EDIT:
Not much changes!
Set about updating the firmware.. downloaded everything ..PC only! My win 7 is hardly ever turned on these days!
The software does not recognize the Devo 10.. and cannot update.
Is it paranioa or another lump of junk all the way from China????
 
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H

HDtallrider

Well-Known Member
I'm glad to hear you got most of your stuff. I am unfamiliar with the Devo radios. Reach out to holtneil. He should be able to help or at least he will know who to send you to. He is in the Uk.
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
HDtallrider said:
I'm glad to hear you got most of your stuff. I am unfamiliar with the Devo radios. Reach out to holtneil. He should be able to help or at least he will know who to send you to. He is in the Uk.
Click to expand...
Hi, I left UK 7 years ago 28th October 2008! I have found 1 of the problems. The Devention firmware upgrade tool - does not recognise the transmitter. Plodding through YT vids and noticed it.
Never had one before so never realized it would show the TX name/Type.
My view is simple... its another lump of junk somebody returned and a game EB are playing knowing its junk - but they have fulfilled their "credit refund". Or am I just really hacked off with them and paranoid!!!!
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
Build List:

Frame: $50 DJI clone - eBay
Motors: DJI 2312 960kv ( same as on my P3P - so I have props! and the motors must be good!!) Foxtech
ESCs: Simonk 30A Brushless ESC with 5V 2A BEC - BangGood
FC: CC3D - ebay
Radio: Devo 10 - EveryBuying ( from refund/Credit note) Not sure it even works, I don't have an RF sniffer
Receiver: RX1002-w - BangGood also coming from eBay a 601 - ( clicked the wrong *&(*&$ link and didnt notice!)
Battery: 11.1V 4500mAh 3S 30C Lipo eBay

Plus a truckload of bits - electrical ties, screwdrivers, velcro straps, banana plugs, "damping" frame and cover box for FC, landing gear for the frame, XT60 M "Fm,battery charger......

Which is the wrong item!
 
H

HDtallrider

Well-Known Member
Quadcopter102 said:
Build List:

Frame: $50 DJI clone - eBay
Motors: DJI 2312 960kv ( same as on my P3P - so I have props! and the motors must be good!!) Foxtech
ESCs: Simonk 30A Brushless ESC with 5V 2A BEC - BangGood
FC: CC3D - ebay
Radio: Devo 10 - EveryBuying ( from refund/Credit note) Not sure it even works, I don't have an RF sniffer
Receiver: RX1002-w - BangGood also coming from eBay a 601 - ( clicked the wrong *&(*&$ link and didnt notice!)
Battery: 11.1V 4500mAh 3S 30C Lipo eBay

Plus a truckload of bits - electrical ties, screwdrivers, velcro straps, banana plugs, "damping" frame and cover box for FC, landing gear for the frame, XT60 M "Fm,battery charger......

Which is the wrong item!
Click to expand...

Looks pretty darn good! 2 suggestions. Maybe look into the Naza M lite instead of the CC3d which is more of an acro controller. You will be familiar with the Naza from your Phantom and it will be easier to set up. Next you might consider the Multistar 10c 5200mah battery. Get 2 of them. You don't need 30c unless you're trying to set speed records. Here is the link;

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...apacity_3S_5200mAh_Multi_Rotor_Lipo_Pack.html

These are lighter than the standard batteries. You should get impressive flight times with these. probably 20-25 minutes. Or just get everything on your list which will all work fine. My suggestions were just refinements. Happy building!
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
Battery - was basically chosen on 2s - 3s spec... also ignorant as to what 30c entails! Learning curve is still at ground level and smooth!

Your suggestion are good.
The parts list is a result of looking at the cheaper end of things and BangGood not having stock and cancelled orders. There is none of that nonsense as EverBuying with only refunds to credit! The out of stock cancellation was back in PayPal 48 hours later! Almost three months on.. still not got all the "refund" I was due on the Syma.

I opted to get the ESCs - again from BG - and really without knowing better ended up with "switching"- the cancelled order was for the ESCs you suggested in your post above.

I am expecting - in one way or another - to get it wrong and blow some bits. This is a training bench job! The motors are from Foxtech, but BG also have them and my logic was.. I know what they do for the Phantom - so they must be able to deal with - what in effect is a slightly smaller frame. Phantoms are 490 diagonal.
I am treating the build as a "training session" and expect later to end up stripping bits for other another kit.... or giving up on building! I spotted on Foxtech a T Motors 280 racer RTF and their gear is good! $250 + shipping.
I have spent us$340 on parts and bits so far!

Saved on the costs of a TX which as seen above was paid for by a refund on my rubbish syma. It seems OK but its been out before...seals broke and just slight out of alignment on the left stick gimbal - suggests a return or a mode switch. No receiver suggests ( to me) that Walkera got it back - took the receiver which they can use as new.. and sell off the radios because its not worth time and labour doing repairs. I think this is how and why so much comes out of these stores that is defective.

Now its down to waiting while all the bits wend their merry way from China and Hong Kong.

Thanks for your - very sound - best parts suggestions.
 
GJH105775

GJH105775

Off and on
Moderator
Quadcopter102 said:
Battery - was basically chosen on 2s - 3s spec... also ignorant as to what 30c entails! Learning curve is still at ground level and smooth!

Your suggestion are good.
The parts list is a result of looking at the cheaper end of things and BangGood not having stock and cancelled orders. There is none of that nonsense as EverBuying with only refunds to credit! The out of stock cancellation was back in PayPal 48 hours later! Almost three months on.. still not got all the "refund" I was due on the Syma.

I opted to get the ESCs - again from BG - and really without knowing better ended up with "switching"- the cancelled order was for the ESCs you suggested in your post above.

I am expecting - in one way or another - to get it wrong and blow some bits. This is a training bench job! The motors are from Foxtech, but BG also have them and my logic was.. I know what they do for the Phantom - so they must be able to deal with - what in effect is a slightly smaller frame. Phantoms are 490 diagonal.
I am treating the build as a "training session" and expect later to end up stripping bits for other another kit.... or giving up on building! I spotted on Foxtech a T Motors 280 racer RTF and their gear is good! $250 + shipping.
I have spent us$340 on parts and bits so far!

Saved on the costs of a TX which as seen above was paid for by a refund on my rubbish syma. It seems OK but its been out before...seals broke and just slight out of alignment on the left stick gimbal - suggests a return or a mode switch. No receiver suggests ( to me) that Walkera got it back - took the receiver which they can use as new.. and sell off the radios because its not worth time and labour doing repairs. I think this is how and why so much comes out of these stores that is defective.

Now its down to waiting while all the bits wend their merry way from China and Hong Kong.

Thanks for your - very sound - best parts suggestions.
Click to expand...
http://quadcopterforum.com/threads/battery-c-rate-and-what-it-means.4695/
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
Advice guys, pleeeeese..
ZTW Spider Series 30A Small OPTO Multi-Rotor ESC 2~6S (SimonK Firmware) were suggested above.

I purchase a single emax 2212 980kva - because I am told emax make motors for the DJI Phantom - never read on any forum of any issues with the actual motors. The idea of teh motor was to try the ESC ordered from BangGood only to read AFTER I ordered that they seem to be fakes or whatever - but not 30a and not flashed with SimonK and then saw that 360 Painless had blown escs and motors - on the same build list ( I used his as my guide!)
I checked the eMax website and found "EMAX Simon Series 30a ESCs " so are they a "safe buy" at about 50% less than cost of the ZTW??
 
ringolong

ringolong

Well-Known Member
Be careful when always searching for the lowest price. Also, I have had terrible luck with emax motors, but I could have had clones lol. (it was for my very first build)

Have you checked out sunny sky motors?
 
H

HDtallrider

Well-Known Member
I can't believe that Emax makes the motors for DJI. I have a friend that used Emax motors and DYS ESC's and had horrible luck. He replaced 3 failed ESC's and 2 motors before he had 6 hours flying. When the second motor failed (magnets came loose) he bought T-Motor ESC's and motors and has about 3 months of trouble free flying under his belt now. Many of us on the forum have experienced the false economy of buying cheap with no back up from the supplier. Quite costly in the long run.
I know you Aussies have a supply issue. Can you give us a list of suppliers that will ship to you? There are a lot of knowledgeable people on the forum that will be happy to help you pick. For example, does Hobby King ship to you? Their Multistar product line has been improving and may be a good choice for you. Another possibility is buying a power system kit from DJI like the E300. They are complete. All you have to do is install it. They also have controllers. This certainly won't be cheap but it will be dependable and you can use the parts as spares for your Phantom when you decide to build bigger. You could buy a Rx from them as well and use the Tx from your Phantom to fly both quads. That would solve your Devo problem other than getting a refund on it.
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
7am just getting ready to drive dowb to Sydney..its bleak dark and raining heavy!
The price difference is due to different brands - but I take the point. The motors I have ordered from Foxtech - who are just as bad as the cheap stores on delivery - paid for 5 - 10 days and its 20 so far - are genuine DJI - and because I know the Phantom motors is why I opted for them.
Just had problems getting the ZTW ESCs and noticed a view of the many 450 buyild Vids on YT seem to be using emax.
But the Aussie Hobbyking store has the ZTW in stock - so will be ordering when I get back from Sydney = pity they dont allow walk in sales at HK!
 
Quadcopter102

Quadcopter102

Well-Known Member
If anybody is still taking notes.....o_O

I am clear with EvertBuying - they beat me in the end. The Devo 10 does not ( as far as I and Open pilot and trying to bind it with 1 RX1002 and a RX601 - they don't! In Open pilot ( CC3D) the receivers shows a full set of Leds. TX shows 1 green Led! At a range of 2 feet.

I ended up with a set of Mars motors from EverBuying to use up the credit for the trash Devo! I just lost the will to keep up a running battle with them.
EScs from BangGood and having flashed the with simonK - either I blew them up or they never worked!
Going through OpenPilot.. when it co0mes to setting the min max on motors... they just shudder and and never spin. Logically they aint getting any power
I purchased a 4500mah Lipo and a 3 cell balance charger... when they arrived I charged the battery and both seemed OK.
With the 450 all but built and finished.. the setting up showed the Devo was dead - and the 4500 battery was also.
I contacted the eBay store and without quibble they are sending me another. I took it apart and found that the - neg wire was connected to a flimsy piece of thin "tin foil" as were all the cells - each had a rectangle of foam on top to keep teh soldered joint from toughing - except somebody "pinched" it when the sealed cell 3 - the foam was pulled down and basically left the - 3mm -neg cable lose. Pulling it about to plug it in obviously moved it and killed the cell. 2 cells where showing 12v + but I don't think a bodge up rewire was worth the messing added to a lack of trust in it and its going in the trash!

So now I need another Radio .
I have a set of Emax EScs coming.
I have 4 DJI phantom 3 motors - which get used when I am sure I am not blowing things up! ( two days from China via DHL!)
I have a KK2.1.5 KK21EVO Flight Controller Board w/ LCD Second MPU for S.BUS DSM2 DSMX coming
And a 33o frame is also on its way.

Its hard finding a radio that is in stock anywhere except China! FrSky Taranis mode 2 - not one in Australia it seems!
HobbyKing have Turnigy 9X 9Ch Transmitter w/ Module & 8ch Receiver (Mode 2) (v2 Firmware) - which I thought might do for a starter.
Orange... only mode 1

Looks like becoming a longer build time that Concorde...
 
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