Quadcopter Science Project

[Ir88ed]

Hello! This will be our first quad copter build, and my son and his team plan on using the finished copter as part of a science/engineering project.

For the science project, the boys need to pick some variable to change, and then measure the effect. What we were thinking is the effect of battery weight/power on time to ascend to 100ft (not exactly sure how we will measure 100ft).

Does this sound reasonable, and are there several different compatible batteries available that could be tested? Does anyone have any other suggestions for things we could test? Basically, it would need to be something that can measured and graphed.

Reading some of the other posts in this section, I see that including a build list is common, so below is what we are thinking. Please also feel free to comment, as this is our first build and we really have no experience to rely on here.

-BW® 2 Pairs 9047/9047R Propellers Propes 9x4.7" Blades

-SKYRC iMAX B6AC V2 Dual Power (6Amps, 50Watts) Balancing Battery Charger

-Generic 10cm Male to Male Extension Lead Wire Cable for KK MWC Eagle Control Board(pack of 10pcs)

-Turnigy 9X 9Ch Transmitter w/ Module & 8ch Receiver (Mode 2) (v2 Firmware)

-Hobbypower KK2.1 LCD Flight Control Board 1.9S Firmware for Multirotor Flying Wing V-tail

-Neewer® RC Accessories Set 680g 1000KV Outrunner Brushless Motor + 30A Electric Speed Controller ESC

NEEWER® 4-Axis HJ450 Frame Airframe FlameWheel Strong Smooth KK MK MWC Quadcopter

Battery:
Lectron Pro 11.1 volt - 3000mAh 30C Upgrade Lipo with XT60 Connector for DJI Phantom

 

[holtneil]

Hi Good list your need to get the flash lead for the KK as the firmware it comes with lets it down , your want steveis1.8s1pro this is very stable
One thing you can do is run different props this will give you more or less lift , your see this on the hover point of the quad
if you put a mark on the transmitter at just over 50% throttle, as the prop sizes change the quad will hover higher or lower at the mark on the throttle so this will tell you what is a more efficient prop size ,this will be a lot cheaper than buying loads of lipos

 

[Ir88ed]

Thanks, holtneil! I like the idea of different props. I will do a little home work and put together a list of props to try. I will also add the flash lead to the list. Thanks!

 

[holtneil]

Hi mate when your ready to flash it let me know I will give you links for the software and firmware , also I forgot to say get the KK 2.1.5 hard case
like this one its takes a crash better as the lcd is removed for flight
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...ard_With_Remote_Programmer_UK_Warehouse_.html

 

[Ir88ed]

Ok, I found props that range in size from 8x4.5 to 12x3.8:
8x4.5: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00O8MJEIU...UTF8&colid=1R6K5JQSM4UFG&coliid=IQVRMRAYR9BE8
9x4.7: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00S67HL4W...lid=1R6K5JQSM4UFG&coliid=I3VDUYBSLSPWSK&psc=1
10x4.5: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00SKIDM18...lid=1R6K5JQSM4UFG&coliid=I27YOBDOABKFG4&psc=1
11x4.7: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00T49TWC0...TF8&colid=1R6K5JQSM4UFG&coliid=I1QULUS94NXWJ2
12x3.8: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00T4AHKDW...TF8&colid=1R6K5JQSM4UFG&coliid=I293WHHH3LL0KP

Do any of those look like they would be incompatible with this build? I will keep looking to see if I can find any smaller or larger props. It would be nice if there were a wide range of performance between the smallest and largest props, so that the graphs look good.

 

[holtneil]

Hi mate most 1000kv dont like to run over 10 inch I cant find any info on what props can run on this motor
So to be safe or the esc can catch on fire use 8x4.5 9x4.5 10x4.5 you can also get 10x4.7 also try tri blades like these
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...e_Blade_8x4_5_Propeller_Black_1Pair_Bag_.html

 

[Ir88ed]

Thank you for the advice! Tri-blade propellers are great idea. Fire would be OK, as long as it is the last data point and the QC didn't careen out of control. I would guess that using bigger motors and higher amperage ESCs would just force some other component to fail, right?

 

[holtneil]

Its a strange world big KV motors like smaller props low KV motors run bigger props , I have a 700mm quad 30amp esc 650kv pan motors and run 14x5.5 props the 450 and 666mm quad runs 1000kv motors and 10x4,7 props still 30amp esc , what you need to do is look at what amps the biggest prop will pull on that motor now thereis no spec on the motor you are looking at ,so i worked on the as its the same as my 1000kv motor a 10x4.7 pulls about 20amps max but i like to play safe , also the max amps is only for a sec once props are spinning at the speed you ask on the throttle the loading on the esc will drop off

 

[Ir88ed]

The plan will be to see how many pennies the quadcopter can lift with the different blades on a fresh battery.

Had to make a few changes to the original list due to availability. Here is the list that I ended up ordering.

Charger ($70): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ND7J38C/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
DX7s Transmitter (Turnigy on backorder, $207): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004ZIOF2C/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s03?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Kasotek KK21 ($35): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00NNXSFBM/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s02?ie=UTF8&psc=1
USB programmer ($8): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DU4A58A/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s03?ie=UTF8&psc=1
3000mAh battery ($45): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LES98XW/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s03?ie=UTF8&psc=1
FlameWheel airframe ($16): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00ATLP6WM/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
1000KV motors/ESC's ($18x4=$72): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FMNUF7I/ref=od_aui_detailpages04?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Propellers:
12x4.5 ($20): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CYA1SJQ/ref=od_aui_detailpages00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
11x4.7 ($10): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00S7IBGAK/ref=od_aui_detailpages02?ie=UTF8&psc=1
10x4.7 ($12): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00EQWQE4O/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o03_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
9x4.7 ($9): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00S67HL4W/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o06_s02?ie=UTF8&psc=1
8x4.5 ($9): http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00S9FPFF8/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I was a bit disappointed that the Turnigy controller that we had picked out had gone on backorder. The 11 and 12 inch props were included just to have more data points for the graphs. We will run the biggest props last in case we cause damage to the esc's or other components. We tried to find all 4.7 pitch propellers, but they just were not available at the extreme sizes.
The control board had to changed because the Hobbyking version wasn't going to be available until mid-March.

 

[GJH105775]

Be sure to post the results, this info is very handy and practical.

 

[Ir88ed]

You can look forward to graphs (and a video if the 12 inch props cause it to catch fire).

 

[holtneil]

Hi good set up , All I will say is if it does catch on fire just cut one lead from battery But dont touch any part of it Lipos burn badly do all tests out side and have a foam fire extinguisher

 

[Ir88ed]

HA! My son and I were rolling! Fuego!
He will take the video in to show the boys he is working with.
It is good to see that there is possible danger, and to have a fire extinguisher on hand.
Parts started arriving and everyone is pretty excited.

 

[GJH105775]

My parts have been arriving for the last two and a half months. This stuff takes forever to ship. I swear they are holding this stuff in boats for weeks just to make you want to buy priority shipping . I have ordered things from China with free shipping and gotten them within two weeks while waiting for hobby stuff for months. Would foam be a class A or B fire? It is not like wood or paper, as it is more of a chemical fire, but yet not a liquid either. I know that most are ABC rated, but still...

 

[holtneil]

Hi mate this is why we go for a foam one as it covers it and take the air out of the fire triangle , you know you need all 3 for a fire

 

[Ir88ed]

Well, here is the final quad. I can't say how great this project was for my 13 year old son and his friends. They did all of the work, once the parts were finalized (thanks holtneil for all the help!) .
They learned to solder and shrink wrap, and spent a lot of time figuring out how to measure the pulling power. They did a fantastic job working as a group to figure out how to solve a problem.

The question they were trying to answer is how much pulling power the different sized props could generate.

The quad:
http://1drv.ms/1Bpwnsh
The testing bench:
http://1drv.ms/1Bpwqoc
The data:
http://1drv.ms/1Bpwu7s

One of the test runs:

We have a bunch of the 8 inch propellers, and are using those to practice. My son says he wants to graph the number of broken props by day to show our improvement in flying skills.

 

[GJH105775]

Haha, broken props would be a great way to measure skill xD. If you fly in a wide open area then you don't break as many. Or so I have found.

 

[holtneil]

HI I am glad they enjoyed the project , this means its going to become a hobby for them , Its nice to see the young children get away from PC Games and do some thing for real
The other way they could have done it was to fit props upside down so they pull down on the quad , then fix the quad to a set of scales so when the quad pushed down it gave them a reading this would then be the same as lift , I love they way it was tied down to tame the beast

 

[Ir88ed]

Probably should mention that while the big props did make more thrust, we had a hard time actually flying the quad with the bigger props (tried the 11" ones the other day). I am assuming that the bigger props make it harder for the quad to make adjustments in prop speed, leading to instability. We will give it a go with the other sizes to see which seem to fly the best. We have a bunch of the 8" ones, and have been using those to learn to fly. Those seem to work pretty well.

 

[GJH105775]

Bigger props are harder to spin up fast, and have more momentum so slowing them down is also harder. This is one of the reasons for collective pitch, pitch can be changed quickly without having to try to spin up or slow down the rotor.