New Member, build compatibility

Jazzman · May 7, 2020

Dugdog47 · May 8, 2020

I've used those racerstar 2205 BR2205 2300KV motors before, very powerful. Also the first motors I've ever worn out, the bearings get loose after 100 flights or so but they were VERY fast.

I've not tried the mamba stack but they are very popular so they must be doing something right.

You don't want higher kv motors than that for a 5" build. If you're planning on using a higher voltage battery than 4s you would actually want lower kv.

An all in one stack like the mamba doesn't need a pdb.

Jazzman · May 8, 2020

Dugdog47 said:
I've used those racerstar 2205 BR2205 2300KV motors before, very powerful. Also the first motors I've ever worn out, the bearings get loose after 100 flights or so but they were VERY fast.

Thanks a bunch man

!! Thats good to know

!!
The bearings are taking an absolute beating, I ride longboads alot and I know all about buying new bearings/the value of good quality ones!! I imagine thats gonna be part of the upgrade in cost of more expensive/better quality motors?

Also have been told the 1600mw vtx is just simply overkill, also i wont need a seperate receiver as one should come with the transmitterill need to buy.

Also that seperate ESC's are only NECESSERY when aggressively propping motors or experimenting with battery cell amounts?
Also that ZOP are crap battaries xD
Any other ovservations?

Dugdog47 · May 8, 2020

If you want higher quality motors for about $10 more you can get the emax eco motors. I personally use those and love em.

Dugdog47 · May 8, 2020

There are pros and cons to using 4 in 1 escs as opposed to singles. If one blows the singles are very easy to swap out where as you'll be replacing your whole 4 in 1 board of one blows.

Don't buy the zop batteries, almost any other brand is better.

Dugdog47 · May 8, 2020

1600 mw vtx is actually illegal to use unless you have a ham licence lol. I usually use 800mw and that is plenty.

Jazzman · May 8, 2020

Oh nice, emax is a brand I've seen OFTEN, Ill look into them!!
2300 or 2800 Kv?
I plan on running 4s battery and 5045s props, so im getting like almost a kilo of lift per motor with the 2300 and more like 650g with the 2800.
My thinking is that the 2800, in a 14v system, will still give nearly 1:5 weight to lift.... the 2300 is like 1:8 or something crazy.
So would I be better off getting the 2800, or are they going to burn out when I try to put a more heavy battery and do the same stunts? Do I just buy more batteries instead to keep the speed?

Or do I buy the 2300, sacrifice some speed, but have the power to carry a (MUCH) larger battery if I wanted, or higher pitched props (provided the escs) can take it!!

Pros of 4 in 1 apart from ease of build/less wires/soldering??

I know, I chose the ZOP before any feedback or really looking into batteries themselves too much haha... I'm looking at this:

[US$44.99 17% OFF] TATTU R-LINE Version 3.0 14.8V 1800mAh 120C 4S Lipo Battery XT60 Plug for FPV RC Drone RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com

TATTU R-LINE Version 3.0 14.8V 1800mAh 120C 4S Lipo Battery XT60 Plug for FPV RC Drone

m.banggood.com

Or even this with the 2800Kv:

[US$31.99 18% OFF] URUAV 18.5V 1500mAh 100C 5S Lipo Battery XT60 Plug for FPV Racing Drone RC Parts from Toys Hobbies and Robot on banggood.com

URUAV 18.5V 1500mAh 100C 5S Lipo Battery XT60 Plug for FPV Racing Drone

m.banggood.com

Omg didn't know it was illegal, thanks for the heads up!!

Jazzman · May 8, 2020

Dugdog47 said:
I've used those racerstar 2205 BR2205 2300KV motors before, very powerful. Also the first motors I've ever worn out, the bearings get loose after 100 flights or so but they were VERY fast.

I've not tried the mamba stack but they are very popular so they must be doing something right.
Just reread this and realised i missed these comments lol, ty for that and letting me knowni dont need a pdb with the stack, I thought the 4in1 literally just replaced the escs themselves.

You don't want higher kv motors than that for a 5" build. If you're planning on using a higher voltage battery than 4s you would actually want lower kv.
Still tryna wrap my head around this tbh.... lower kv is lower gear? Yes? Low RPM, higher torque (to carry around those extra battery cell weight) and higher Kv is higher gear, high top speed/RPM but low torque? You typically see higher Kv in tiny whoops coz there's no mass to em, so they can spin fast without burning out.
whereas model rc planes are typically even down around 950Kv, to be able to spin such large props!!

And voltage is literally tied to RPM.... so if my motor kv is too high... they're just gonna burn out tryna turn props that are taking big bites of the air to give enough thrust to lift the heavier battery... and that battery is giving them more volts at also a higher current, yes?
Hence lower kv to cop the torque? So go with 2300!! I know 2800 is the top of what a 5" csn take, but didn't realise l theyd be an issue with didferent batteries which i definitely want to try/see/feel ror myself

An all in one stack like the mamba doesn't need a pdb.
Thanks man, went over my head, saved me 10 bucks and some legit confusion down the track!!

Dugdog47 · May 8, 2020

I don't really understand the kv deal either lol. I do know that the higher voltage batteries need lower kv motors. (for a 5" 4s I use 24xx kv where 6s would use 17xx kv roughly.)

I'm just a hack lol there are people WAY smarter than me here. My accomplishments only include building 15 or so kwads.

Dugdog47 · May 8, 2020

Then when you go micro it gets even worse lol I think my 2" tyro has 8000kv motors.

Jazzman · May 9, 2020

Dugdog47 said:
I don't really understand the kv deal either lol. I do know that the higher voltage batteries need lower kv motors. (for a 5" 4s I use 24xx kv where 6s would use 17xx kv roughly.)
Kinda makes sense, except easier for me to think of it the other way around. Where lower Kv motors, need, or CAN HANDLE more volts because they are designed to spin maybe not faster, but with more force, than a higher kv, which doesn't need a heap of juice, coz it's just gotta spin quick, with not much force...
It's like.... We have a flour mill... If we put light little tiny wheat in their, we dont need the river running that strong to keep the mill turning nicely, it can go as fast as it wants, but it doesnt need much power while it does; Light little quads with fast (high kv) but weak motors don't need a heap of volts to go?
But if we're tryna grind corn... bigger, denser, we need more flow from the river coz the mill is doing more work while it turns, it doesn't have to grind FAST necesserily, but it needs power in its rotation; heavier kwads with slower (lower KV) motors need those fewer strokes/less RPM but to be more powerful to lift more weight?
I've also heard that you can increase cell count/voltage, and decrease prop diameter, to essentially make the motor more efficient for the same amount of thrust?
SEVERAL youtubers I've seen, with specifically 6" kwads, talk about running 5" props on 6s battaries... Not entirely sure the KV on their motors/would have to find them again but I'd guess around 2000kv flat?

I'm just a hack lol there are people WAY smarter than me here. My accomplishments only include building 15 or so kwads.
Well hey man, there's a difference between humble and self depricating hahaha, 15 is nothing to sneeze at... Don't call yourself a PRO maybe, but no hack by the sounds of it haha. Definitely given me some pointers so far

Jazzman · May 9, 2020

Oh, ALSO had like, 4 people on 2 different forums tell me to just buy a kit... It's quite annoying actually... Tryna talk me out of what I was so keen and interested in doing... Like I'm some 16 with halfhearted interest not a 25 year old with serious intent haha?

Anyway... They reccommend the Tyro99 5" or even the Tyro119 6" (for a little more stability and flight time) DIY kits

Any experience with these?

Dugdog47 · May 9, 2020

I've built the tyros 69&79 they are both excellent kits but I say piece it together yourself at first, build something truly unique.

Jazzman · May 9, 2020

Nice!! Thanks man!!

So the frame looks good?
But you reccomend better motors? Regardless of brand, 2300 or 2800Kv?

Mamba stack seems to have a good rep to me?
Or replace the 4in1 with individual ones? What are the actual pros to 4in1 besides neatness and less wires/soldering?
If I end up getting individual ESC's, I should pretty much just get the best yeah?
And that PDB looks okay if I do?

Also with the VTX, I found out today that highe rthan 25mW is illegal in Australia, but they get set to 25 automatically, so which is nicer? With the first I will need the 30.5m expander, but the second only mounts to 2 holes!!

Any advice with the camera? CCD is better than CMOS yeah?

I wont need that receiver as it should come with the transmitter which... I mean.... I'll get a taranis next build hahaha
Also I'll get fatsharks next time too hahaha

Jazzman · May 9, 2020

Oh ALSO in regards to the VTX and laws, 5" frames are illegal in australia too, unless you're part of a club paying membership fees for their insurance/CASA registration etc etc etc...
Or.... well... over 250g is illegal... so really anything over a... What... 2", 3"?

Only illegal if you get caught

*shrugs*

wafflejock · May 9, 2020

Jazzman said:
Oh ALSO in regards to the VTX and laws, 5" frames are illegal in australia too, unless you're part of a club paying membership fees for their insurance/CASA registration etc etc etc...
Or.... well... over 250g is illegal... so really anything over a... What... 2", 3"?

Only illegal if you get caught *shrugs*

Yah IANAL (my brother is though so I'll have him go to court for me if need be

), but think so long as you don't fly over people who aren't there to fly with you (best to avoid in general) and aren't flying over busy roads or other things like that where you are likely to put people in danger then it's pretty much no harm no foul. Other people are out driving cars and running power plants spewing nonsense into the air all day long and are creating way more fatalities per hour than I can ever expect to achieve with this little 5" thing

Basically common sense, avoid crowds don't be an butthead [haha autocorrect tamed it down] and everything should mostly be fine (ignore the draconian govs avoid the enforcers if they are being unreasonable, embrace those who are reasonable).

Mildly political rant aside I'd still suggest maybe looking at a 3" even a 3" prebuilt just for the sake of having something to get up in the air with and to use between fixing things on your custom 5". I think it's worth building up a 5" from scratch because parts of it will very likely eventually get damaged and can pick and choose what matters to you and what components you want to sink more or less cost into and upgrade things over time. The arms on a 5" class frame are strong but moving at high speed or diving and hitting something at high speed will still break a 4mm carbon fiber arm (on occasion). The 3" you can fly in smaller fields you can still toss around a bit (not as susceptible to wind as a really tiny one like 2" or whoop class) and is much harder to break (it can happen or you can get a DOA/dud from the factory, but otherwise very tough).

wafflejock · May 9, 2020

I just read the part about not being a savage so you'll have to ignore the first paragraph of my previous post

I kid but will look over parts and give my 2 cents in a bit here too, quick scan looks pretty good I'd suggest comparing transmitter/controller with T16 options out there now with 4 in 1 radio transmitter module can send signals to most hobby receivers so way less trouble/worry finding things you can bind to.

Jazzman · May 10, 2020

wafflejock said:
Yah IANAL (my brother is though so I'll have him go to court for me if need be ), but think so long as you don't fly over people who aren't there to fly with you (best to avoid in general) and aren't flying over busy roads or other things like that where you are likely to put people in danger then it's pretty much no harm no foul. Other people are out driving cars and running power plants spewing nonsense into the air all day long and are creating way more fatalities per hour than I can ever expect to achieve with this little 5" thing Basically common sense, avoid crowds don't be an butthead [haha autocorrect tamed it down] and everything should mostly be fine (ignore the draconian govs avoid the enforcers if they are being unreasonable, embrace those who are reasonable).
Bro you're a breath of fresh air man. I couldn't agree more if I tried. I always use common sense and don't fly around other people unless they come up to me anyway!!
I don't think it's being enforced THAT harshly here anyway to be perfectly honest, I mean we have CASA but I havent heard of them, like, hunting people down.
You'd have to REALLY annoy some people, to have enough complaints to a very specific government department that they'll come deal with you lol.
More likely someone will just call the local police, but again, you'd have to REALLY annoying/scare someone for them to dob you in for what they probably wont be able to see/tell/know on site, IS actually illegal.
What blows my mind is everyones out here flying 700g mavics and 1.2kg phantoms in CBD type locations and parks etc... I know they aren't going 80km/h but like...Unless you're just *unsafe* or a straight up sketchy pilot I think people would only be impressed!
And you're exactly right man, I'm not out here using (probably) child labour built drones, or ones that use petrol (like those little nitro RC cars) or anything of the sort. I'll mind my own business, and damn anyone who has an issue with that.

Mildly political rant aside I'd still suggest maybe looking at a 3" even a 3" prebuilt just for the sake of having something to get up in the air with and to use between fixing things on your custom 5".
Fair bloody cop.
I think it's worth building up a 5" from scratch because parts of it will very likely eventually get damaged and can pick and choose what matters to you and what components you want to sink more or less cost into and upgrade things over time.
For sure
The arms on a 5" class frame are strong but moving at high speed or diving and hitting something at high speed will still break a 4mm carbon fiber arm (on occasion). The 3" you can fly in smaller fields you can still toss around a bit (not as susceptible to wind as a really tiny one like 2" or whoop class) and is much harder to break (it can happen or you can get a DOA/dud from the factory, but otherwise very tough).
Man, I'm not afraid to break things hahahaha xD But I definitely get where you're coming from!
I think honestly, I'm just THAT keen I'm gonna go straight for the 5" custom build, THEN get a 3"kit or prefab/bnf for when I'm waiting for spare parts i didn't order for the 5" (arms, Ive been told, even in carbon fibre, are an absolute must, motor or two, PLENTY of rotors, and a spare antena where reccomended spares with innitial purchase of parts)

Jazzman · May 10, 2020

wafflejock said:
I just read the part about not being a savage so you'll have to ignore the first paragraph of my previous post I kid but will look over parts and give my 2 cents in a bit here too, quick scan looks pretty good I'd suggest comparing transmitter/controller with T16 options out there now with 4 in 1 radio transmitter module can send signals to most hobby receivers so way less trouble/worry finding things you can bind to.

Hahahahahaha, no not at all bro, you're fine, we are birds of a feather in that regard !!

Oh nice. I just watched a Joshua Bardwell video about it and it looks SICK but honestly I'd probably look at just getting Frsky to start with.
Then when I build my next one and upgrade some components besides battery/motor and prop combos and try like, a whole other style of frame even.... THEN I'll get probably this Jumper t16 as opposed to a taranis etc and also Fatshark/Futaba....
Coz the other piece of advice I got was Buy better goggles for when you want... more range and better picture/tvl or screen resolution etc etc etc... I think to just start getting into it, Frsky dedicated, and cheap fpv rig is right where I wanna be

Jazzman · May 10, 2020

Which VTX and camera?
Which Kv motors?
4in1 ESC or individual?

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